A Cry For Justice

Awakening the Evangelical Church to Domestic Violence and Abuse in its Midst

We were right! Dallas Theological Seminary has been using “Sexual Issues” in their BC101 Class

Ok. Here’s the scenario. Back on Feb 20 we published a review of a horrid book entitled Sexual Issues: A Short-term Structured Model by Harold Wahking and Gene Zimmerman. You can read that review here. One of our readers some time ago had informed us of its use in the Dallas Theological Seminary counseling program, and we included that fact in our post. (Click here for that reader’s affirmation of the fact that she passed on the info to us.)

Soon after that post was published, a comment was submitted by John Dyer, Executive Director of Communications and Educational Technology at Dallas Theological Seminary. Here is the important part of his statement (emphasis added):

The stated book, “Sexual Issues” by Wahking and Zimmerman is not a required, recommended, or endorsed text at Dallas Theological Seminary. Although the book is out of print, it is available at our library along with many other books that DTS would neither endorse nor recommend. In the MA in Biblical Counseling program at Dallas Theological Seminary (http://www.dts.edu/mabc) students are correctly taught how to report abuse and the ethical and legal guidelines they must follow.

Well, it turns out that we were right, even though DTS told us we had it all wrong.

We did additional investigation. We sent one of our own team to the DTS library. The clerk at the library desk specifically said that this book is on reserve for this present semester of Biblical Counseling 101, and the staff teaching that course are Dr. Barnes and Dr. Dickens. She said it is on reserve so that all students of the class can have access to it for 2 hours at a time (as with all reserve books).

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On 17 March we emailed three senior staff members at DTS, John Dyer, Gary Barnes, and Chip Dickens, asking if they would like to issue a corrected statement concerning the use of Sexual Issues in the counseling program at DTS. We gave them a six day window in which to respond. Professor Dickens and Professor Barnes have not replied to us at all. John Dyer emailed us on March 18, saying

It sounds like the confusion may be have been that the Wahking/Zimmerman book, while not a required text, has as part of a series been on course reserve at the library, and that the syllabus has a required assignment to address sexual issues.

So DTS finally admits to what we have been saying all along. But of course they don’t express it as a confession of wrong— Dyer called it a ‘confusion’. To us that sounds like weasel words. Dyer may have been confused, but we were not. Nor were the Professors who teach that course: they know very well what the course syllabus says.

Here is the BC 101 Syllabus taught by Dr Charles Dickens in Spring 2013. (if the link no longer works let us know)

Assessment task 3 in the course, worth 40% of the marks, is as follows

Each student will select one of the ten volumes from the Strategic Pastoral Counseling Series [“Sexual Issues” is one book in that series]. . . . Each student will prepare and present a 20 minute powerpoint workshop as though they were leading a professional training for pastors in Strategic Pastoral Counseling Model applied to their particular topic. Each student’s powerpoint presentation will be uploaded to the course website for all students of the class to download for future use.

That means the book Sexual Issues (as part of a 10-volume set) would fulfill required reading for students who are studying Biblical Counseling 101.

BC101 Pastoral Counseling,  Course Description

BC101 Pastoral Counseling, Course Description

BC101 Assessment Task 3 (powerpoint presentation)

BC101 Assessment Task 3 (powerpoint presentation)

That is not a peripheral use of a book. It show that the Professors of Biblical Counseling at DTS thought the book Sexual Issues was very good.  

We have hard evidence on DTS, but DTS may not be the only seminary using this book to teach counseling. We know that this book is in other seminary libraries.

DTS’s response to us fell short of what we had hoped for. We believe that at the very least they should have said: “You were right. That book is being used in our course. It should not have ever been used. This was a mistake and we are correcting it.”

Let’s remember that the book Sexual Issues encourages pastors to consider not reporting child sexual abuse by a perpetrator if the perpetrator seems repentant!  This is not its only deficiency, but this alone disqualifies it for use in any counseling class. Here’s the passage from page 162:

Sometimes there are alternatives, though they are very difficult in terms of the Christian ethic. You may want to consider talking privately with the perpetrator, and if he or she confesses and commits to not being abusive again and enters professional counseling immediately, you may commit yourself to not reporting the abuse for now while maintaining close contact with the person’s therapist. 

Criminey!! Are you kidding us? How many of our readers would say ‘Oh, well hey, if my abuser confesses to what he did to me and promises he won’t do it again, then all will be well’ ? And how many survivors of sexual abuse have been re-abused and re-abused because that kind of garbage is told to them by church leaders? Pleeeeeezzzz!

The senior people at Dallas Theological College Texas must be aware of  the Texan law for reporting child abuse. Yet they have been endorsing a book which gives advice directly opposing that law.

Tex. Fam. Code Ann. § 261.101 (LexisNexis through 2011 1st Sess.)

A person having cause to believe that a child’s physical or mental health or welfare has been adversely affected by abuse or neglect by any person shall immediately make a report as provided by this subchapter. The requirement to report under this section applies, without exception, to an individual whose personal communications may otherwise be privileged, including an attorney, a member of the clergy, a medical practitioner, a social worker, a mental health professional, and an employee of a clinic or health-care facility that provides reproductive services.

https://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwide/laws_policies/statutes/clergymandated.pdf

And that’s not all. Page 162ff goes on to say that a decision not to report is probably against the law, but the pastor may decide not to report if the following conditions are in place: (honest, this is what this crazy book says),

1. There is reliable basis to believe the abuse has stopped.
2. The perpetrator is alarmed and will not act again.
3. The other parent is fully aware of what has happened.
4. The child is protected both by receiving counseling and by being reassured that if anything abusive happens again, he or she is perfectly free to report it, and
5. Reporting would lead to destruction of home and marriage because of imprisonment and scandal.

Oh yeah. We can’t have imprisonment or scandal, especially in a “Christian” home. Best to just keep the fact that a child was raped or sodomized secret — “just between us, you know.”

Dr. Dickens is the Department Chair and Associate Professor of Biblical Counseling at DTS. Dr. Barnes is a Professor of Biblical Counseling at DTS.  When Mr. Dyer was in email contact with us after our review of Sexual Issues was first published, he recommended that if we had further concerns we should address them to Dr Dickens as Head of the Department of Biblical Counseling.

In the thread of our first post, John Dyer told us they would be removing the entire series to which that book belongs but the decision would have to go through a committee first. We are prepared to accept that a committee resolution might be necessary to remove an entire series of books from the library, especially if that would also entail a rewriting of some curriculum. But this is child sexual abuse we are talking about! It’s not some debatable issue like sprinkling versus immersion baptism. Isn’t it hiding behind process to say you can’t take a book of the shelves until a committee has passed a motion? DTS have been quite content to leave the book on the Reserve shelves in the library. And according to Dyer, they don’t still see removing the book as an urgent matter. Here’s the relevant part of his 18th March email:

after reading your original post we’ve decided to remove the Wahking/Zimmerman book from the library to remove any possible confusion or misunderstanding that DTS would endorse or recommend what the book teaches about reporting abuse.

Well there’s nothing new there, Mr Dyer — you told us that back on Feb 24th!

We believe that anyone who really cared about victims of abuse would have instructed the librarians to immediately remove the book from student access until the committee had met and formally passed its resolution to dispose of the entire series.

Are committee timetables and deliberations more important than present and future victims of child abuse?

The library clerk our team member talked to seemed to have no inkling that concerns had been expressed about the book.

NOTE: in subsequent posts we will be revealing more of the anti-biblical nature of this book. The problems are throughout the book, not merely with the part that advises not reporting child abuse as a viable option for the pastor.

44 Comments

  1. Katy

    Thank you for this vindication. I was upset that my original review had to be edited because of John Dyer’s statements, when I felt pretty sure that it was just spin.
    “Confusion” ??? no, sir. We are not confused at all.
    This book is riddled with the most awful things I’ve ever read coming from a “Christian counselor”. They’ve got wives being choked and raped (and then agreeing to cook hubby his favorite meal) – men addicted to porn and publicly exposing themselves, and the pastor is validating him as a Christian and making sure not to “scare him off” by being too judgmental — every single page of this book was completely outside of “Biblical standards”. Jesus help us, but this is why the Church is so useless!
    In this case, DTS published some videos of their proper response to abuse and proper reporting procedures — but then in class they are learning stuff like this instead. So which one is the truth? Are the videos just for public consumption? And the real attitude toward abusers in the pew is a little more NUANCED?

    • Brenda R

      Why am I not surprised. Katy, you are owed a HUGE apology. I believe this may be a version of crazy making.

  2. StrongerNow

    It seems to me the only possible justification for using that book at all would be as a “good example of a bad example.” Had the response been, “Yes, the book is part of the course, and the students’ assignments are to tear the book apart and show what horrible advice is in it,” then one could possibly approve of its use.

    • Brenda R

      StrongerNow,

      I agree that is the only reason the book should be used. But it is still accessible to those who would believe this is the right course of action. Of course, if students were promoting the book or authors integrity, perhaps they shouldn’t be students any longer.

  3. Saved by Grace

    I felt uncomfortable with John Dyer’s response and comments posted on this blog in February. This further investigation by ACFJ just tells me my discomfort was right on. What a load of c*&^. John Dyer does not have the foggiest clue what he is talking about.

    Committees, committees, we will set up a committee to discuss this matter. What he really means is we will perhaps at some point when we have a little spare time maybe then at a future date yet to be determined will possibly discuss this matter AND oh by the way do nothing. Setting up committees to make a final decision is a ‘c’hurchy thing that accomplishes NOTHING. Why should it be surprising that this committee decision-unmaking process does not also plague seminaries and other educational institutions.

    Sorry for venting. I just needed to let off some steam this morning. This entry kinda opened up a stinky can o’ worms for me.

    • Brenda R

      This is a good place to vent SbG. You didn’t say anything that wasn’t true. When John Dyer said it was just in the library and not directly being used in any courses, he was not being honest with us. He just wanted ACFJ to go away. I have to wonder about the students who wrote here. I don’t like conspiracy theories, but it isn’t looking good.

      • Saved by Grace

        Thanks Brenda. You are right the ACFJ community is an awesome place to go to for support, encouragement, and validation.

  4. Heather2

    After the original articles and discussions with Mr. Dyer I had such hope for a positive change which would show that Dallas Theological Seminary had seen what they were supporting and repented. It would have been very simple to take the book off the shelf. Why would it require so much red tape? They have their heads in the sand while denying the crimes done to victims as well as breaking the law.

    I have said for decades that I would rather send my young adults to secular colleges and universities. At least there is no hypocrisy. At so many “Christian” institutions the real truth of what they believe and who they are is hidden by a false front.
    These schools are putting new pastors in the pulpits. And we wonder why do many if us no longer sit in their pews…..

    • Jeff Crippen

      Heather2 – I don’t think existing “institutions” change, or at least willingly. Over time they become entrenched in power and privilege and perks. Reputations and dollars are on the line. Of course all of this should not be in Christ’s kingdom. He who is least is greatest. We all know we still have sinful flesh in us. So it should never be an earth-shaking event for one of us to say “we did wrong. Please forgive us. We are changing course now.” It seems to me that the response from the true church to such humility would be real forgiveness, not “throw the bums out.” But sadly, the norm is that in these cases change will only be effected through exposure and pressure.

      • Heather2

        Jeff, I agree! Victims will hope for change when we believe deep down that change is not going happen. So exposure is one option which allows us to alert the public to what is hidden behing the big cross in the vestibule.
        I don’t have time in my life any more for phonys and politicians of any ilk! It was a truly sad day in my life when I saw what was happening in churches. These were places where the hurting could find comfort and compassion. The truth hurts.

        However, I will stand by my words…. These schools educate men and women for ministry. They will be future church leaders. My prayer is for The Lord to take His true Church, His Bride, home….. Soon.

      • Brenda R

        Seminaries should not be run like your run of the mill college or university. They are a very special place to learn appropriate Christ-like responses. There is nothing about this from the book itself to the responses given by DTS that is Christ-like. He would be turning over the bookshelves in the library of not only DTS, but any other seminary teaching new disciples how to conduct themselves.

      • Jeff Crippen

        As Katy said, this book contains an arsenal of horrid instruction. We will be posting more articles on it with text right from the book to show what we mean. So why was it used at DTS and, most likely, at other seminaries? There really are only a few possible answers, 1) The professors never took the time to read it and just blindly utilize it because it is a “Christian” book, or 2) They know full well what it says and don’t really have that much of a problem with it, or 3) the know full well what it says and think it’s just great! I think that possibility #1 is pretty unlikely.

  5. Reblogged this on Speakingtruthinlove's Blog.

  6. Kelsey

    Wow very impressed with your vigilance! Keep up the good work!

    • fiftyandfree

      Me too. Your unveiling of these wicked little secrets is helping victims find freedom.

  7. Carmen S.

    God bless the internet.

  8. They may be trying to weasel out of this being “required” because of the following:

    Each student will select one of the ten volumes from the Strategic Pastoral Counseling Series

    I.e., there are nine other books to choose from so the student is not technically required to use/read Sexual Issues. That still doesn’t save them from “recommended” and “endorsed,” though.

    • Brenda R

      Do we know what is in the 9 other volumes of this series? Are they equally as bad?

      • Katy

        Since Dyer said they are (maybe someday) yanking the entire series, I’m sort of curious what other horrors lurk in the other volumes, as well…..

  9. Forrest

    Given that this book recommends breaking the law, it would be reasonable to expect them to act immediately, not to obfuscate. Their actions show their words to be false. Is this really who we want teaching the next generation of pastors?

  10. Carmen S.

    Only a government court ruling in a prominent case directed against the current prevailing evangelical church position of handling child sexual abuse “in house” will change the course. This very well might happen.

  11. Dallas Theological Seminary would again like to thank the team behind Crying out for Justice for your continued vigilance with regards to reporting abuse within the church. I hope the following comments are helpful to your readers.

    In my original comment, I attempted to briefly show that while the DTS library formerly carried the Wahking/Zimmerman book, DTS neither recommends nor endorses its views on reporting abuse. Instead, DTS teaches students about the importance of reporting abuse correctly in multiple venues both in class and in public settings such as podcast that I linked to.

    After that brief comment, I corresponded with Jeff and Barbara via email and attempted to explain in more detail the assignment that prompted the original post. Students are taught explicitly about the need to report abuse in the course, but they also have an assignment where they can choose to present on a topic. In previous years, DTS used the 10 volume series “Strategic Pastoral Counseling Series” (which includes the Wahking/Zimmerman book) as an outline defining the 10 categories from which students could present (this reference was still present in the Houston version of the syllabus for Spring 2013 linked in the main post above). While the series provides the outline for what subject they can cover, students were free to use any resources they find to put together their presentation (For example, the “Strategic Pastoral Counseling Series” has never been available in the Houston library). In other and more recent recent semesters (such as Fall 2012 online, Summer 2013, and Spring 2014 where the assignment is no longer given) the course no longer references the series, because it has since been replaced with Insight for Living’s “Counseling Resources” which states multiple times “Every state requires that you report sexual or physical abuse to the appropriate authorities (usually Child Protective Services). See the sample policy and reporting form in chapter 13, ‘Domestic Abuse.’”

    In this assignment, if a student had chosen to present on the category of “Sexual Issues” and, within that category, chosen to present on sexual abuse, any views the student presented that contradicted what was taught in class about the requirements for reporting abuse would be corrected by the professor in front of the class.

    So while DTS explicitly teaches students to report all cases of abuse, and this book was only available in the context of a course where its incorrect views could be corrected (course reserve prevents students from other courses from using it), the original post prompted the counseling department to ask that the book be removed from the library altogether to prevent any additional possibility that students or visitors would think DTS supports or endorses its views of abuse. I’m not sure when the picture was taken in this post, but as of today the book is no longer in the library.

    I hope that this more complete explanation is helpful. As someone who has personally experienced the pain and repercussions of unreported child abuse in my family, I’m sorry that the lack of detail in my original comment caused additional frustration and pain. I’m also grateful to this blog and its readers for sensitively, graciously, and carefully addressing such an important issue.

    Blessings,

    John Dyer
    Executive Director of Communications and Educational Technology
    Dallas Theological Seminary

    • It seems very strange that you only give us this info after we’ve published this post, John, when we gave you opportunity to tell us before the post was published.

  12. The photo of the Sexual Issues book was taken March 13, 2014 at the DTS library. We meant put that date and time in a caption under the photo.

    • And the library where the photo was taken was the library on the main campus of DTS, Swiss Avenue, Dallas.

  13. thepersistentwidow

    I wonder why it is so difficult to remove this book series and replace it with better quality books? Why is there so much anguish over this? Just throw it away!

  14. The exact wording of the Powerpoint Assignment in the Spring 2013 syllabus which we cited in this post:

    Each student will select one of the 10 volumes from the Strategic Pastoral Counseling Resources series depicting 10 of the commonly presented problems for pastoral counseling: addictive behavior, anger, depression, forgiveness, grief & trauma, guilt & shame, marital stress, parenting issues, sexual issues, and worry. Each student will prepare and present a 20 minute powerpoint workshop as though they were leading a professional training for pastors in the Strategic Pastoral Counseling Model applied to their particular topic.

    The wording of Mr Dyer’s comment above:

    In previous years, DTS used the 10 volume series “Strategic Pastoral Counseling Series” (which includes the Wahking/Zimmerman book) as an outline defining the 10 categories from which students could present (this reference was still present in the Houston version of the syllabus for Spring 2013 linked in the main post above). While the series provides the outline for what subject they can cover, students were free to use any resources they find to put together their presentation.

    Mr Dyer has tried to make out that the ten counseling issues in that 10 volume series were only an ‘outline’ defining the ten categories from which students could present. By this wording, he’s re-writing that syllabus after the fact. It seems to me like he’s just spun a whole lot more spin. The syllabus did not say to use the topics of that ten volume series as simply an outline for which conseling issue students could choose to present on, it told them to choose a book from that series and present that book’s model of counseling to the class.

    You’re not convincing me Mr Dyer. And I would like to you to please stop ‘thanking’ us for our work on this blog. The thanks that would have been meaningful would have been for DTS to openly and uprightly apologize for having ever had that Wakhing/Zimmerman book in its library, on its Reserve shelves, and on its syllabuses, and to have pulled the book off the shelves of the library straight after our first post was published. As it is, your ‘thanks’ just seem patronizing — more spin from the spin doctor.

  15. Friend of Victim

    Barb,

    I think your comments are spot on about Mr. Dwyer. Obviously, he’s the DTS public relations guy doing damage control rather than someone from the faculty or library.

    I, too, have to doubt the sincerity of his thanks for the blog particularly as he published his true opinions about WordPress bloggers in an article in Christianity Today, three years ago, “Not Many of You Should Presume to Be Bloggers.”

    http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2011/marchweb-only/bloggers.html

    Here’s the highlights:

    Throughout the history of public theological debate, there was one constant—those debates only took place between a few select people—Moses, Plato, Augustine, Aquinas, and so on—who gained respect through a lifetime of scholarship.

    (NOTE: Would this not disqualify Christ and His disciples from being able to pursue theological debate?)

    He goes on to say:

    Not Many of You Should Presume to Be Bloggers. What few of us realize is that when we press those ‘Publish,’ ‘Post,’ ‘Comment,’ and ‘Send’ buttons, we are making the shift away from merely ‘believing’ truth and stepping into the arena of publishing that belief. In doing so we are effectively assuming a position of leadership and teaching that prior to 2004 was not available to us.

    James warned us, ‘Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly’ (James 3:1, NIV1984). James goes on to graphically portray the incredible power that our tongues have both to praise and to curse especially in the context of teaching. He then says, ‘Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show it by his good life.’ (James 3:13). Solomon echoes similar wisdom, ‘Even a fool is thought wise if he keeps silent’ (Prov. 17:28).

    Mr. Dyer’s dripping condescension/arrogance toward other Christians who are blogging is breathtaking. He seems to presume most of the bloggers are not highly educated. First of all, it’s not true. I imagine most bloggers are highly educated (perhaps, not seminarians, though). Secondly, the level of bloggers’ education is not at all important. As a colleague of mine once said to me, “You can be an educated idiot.”

    He also infers that God only works through people “properly indoctrinated” at man made educational institutions (which are not mentioned in the Bible).

    The irony is that he appears to count himself among the select few with Moses, Plato, etc.. because he has proudly advertised on the web that he’s published numerous articles (where I found this one), a book, and now will be going to work on his PhD.

    I’ll close with what I feel is a more appropriate passage in this regard than what Mr. Dyer cited.

    1 Corinthians 1:26-31 (NIV)

    26 Brothers and sisters, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. 28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him. 30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: “Let the one who boasts boast in the Lord.”

    • Thanks, Friend of Victim. This comment of yours is very illuminating.

    • Yeah. Somehow I doubt that Dyer really says to God, “Thank you, Lord, for the work A Cry For Justice is doing!”

    • Brenda R

      Amen, FoV. I have had pastors over the years with no formal education that had a clearer understanding of Jesus than many with a doctorate. I have heard some “learned” pastors who are harsh and followers of law more than followers of Christ. When teachers are teaching false doctrine, are we to still follow their tutelage just because they have a degree made up of man-made courses that perhaps never should have been taught? I don’t think so. We may hear what they are saying, but we need to read our Bibles and ask God for discernment. We need to admit when we are wrong, including those with masters degrees or PhD’s, repent of what we know should not be taught and make amends for it even if it means having a book go through the shredder.
      I’m sure Mr. Dyer did not think this past article or his book would be brought up, but I agree with your summation of his writing. He is looking down on others without thinking about the fact that he also has his own blog and is putting his views in print. He makes the case that blogs do not give you time for prayer and reflection. If that is true, then why are you adding to that which you so despise? There were so many uneducated teachers in the Bible. Yet they were called to do just that. Fishermen were called to walk alone side the Savior and tell others the Good News. Book knowledge and passing man-made classes does not make one have heart felt knowledge. Head knowledge can be dangerous. It is what comes from the heart that counts.

      • Heather2

        Amen, Brenda. The last time I checked, Jesus called humble fishermen, a tax collector, and finally, Paul, the only academic in the group. And yet after presenting his credentials he counted them as nothing compared to his knowledge of The Lord Jesus Christ.

        Those with “credentials” are often the very ones with no mercy toward victims.

        Thank you, everyone at ACFJ, for this revelation. Jeff is right that we need to expose more of this. But man is full of himself and will make excuses instead of repentance.

        Barb, thank you for calling Mr. Dyer out.

        Ellie, guess your proximity to the school and visit to the library wasn’t one he expected. Good work!

        Marital abuse is not a theory to be discussed but a reality that hurts and kills. Maybe students need to visit safe houses, jails, and hospitals to see the reality in person.

    • In doing so we are effectively assuming a position of leadership and teaching that prior to 2004 was not available to us.

      I wonder if women can blog, then.

      • Brenda R

        Hester,

        I am sure we shouldn’t. There is probably a twisted scripture somewhere that prohibits it. I am guarding my laptop in case the blogging police come to the door.

      • Don’t worry, Brenda, we can obtain tent pegs and mallets and be Jaells, if they take away our laptops!

      • Well, if Dyer is comp, then that is the logical outcome of his statement. Women can’t lead or teach men, men read blogs/the internet, ergo women cannot blog because they might lead and/or teach a man. So I guess you’d better get in line, Barb. 😉

  16. Ellie

    Mr. Dyer,
    I went to the DTS Dallas campus on March 13, 2014 and spoke with a very polite and knowledgeable clerk at the library there. I asked about this book. The clerk explained the reserve policy and scanned it to see which class it is presently being used for. I asked who teaches the class. Barnes and Dickens was the answer. I asked if it was being used this semester. I specifically asked if it is being used for Spring 2014. The reply was, “yes.” I asked if I could photograph the book. Again, the answer was, “yes.”

    As I live nearby, it is difficult to throw a rock in any direction without hitting a DTS grad or student. I have asked some about this class and this assignment. Our understanding of the syllabus and this assignment has been confirmed by former students. On March 13, 2014, I was told that this book was on reserve so that the students of BC101 could have access to it for the Spring 2014 classes.

    I am glad to hear that the students are informed of the laws to protect victims who are children. Are they also told not to encourage wives who’ve been abused to cook better for their abusers? I listened to Barnes and Dickens discuss divorce prevention for an hour and abuse wasn’t addressed at all. Nor was repentance.

    Thank you for finally removing the book from the DTS library.

    Ellie

    • Ellie

      I would like to add that I personally believe that Dyer has been misled and he’s just a relay switch here. It is unfortunate that Professors Dickens and Barnes haven’t stepped up themselves to address what goes on in their classrooms. When I called DTS in February to ask them to please discontinue the use of this book, I called the office of the counseling division. The call went to the division office which should’ve made Dickens aware of this. In fact, though I didn’t leave my name or contact info, the counseling office called me back! I asked the caller to please contact Jeff and Barbara. I am not sure how or why this was handed to Dyer who doesn’t teach this class or select the materials to be used in it. I have heard good things about Dyer in my research of this matter. People who know him think highly of him. I would like to think that he is doing what he’s told and what he believes. I would like to see the professors handling this themselves instead of handing it off.

      As to the question of who should be blogging, I think the CBMW should’ve taken Dyers’ advice and stayed off the internet, eh?

  17. We have received a few comments from DTS supporters. While we are willing to publish comments from DTS Biblical Counseling faculty, we are not going to make this thread open for all and any DTS fan given that so far their attempts to rebut us are just repeating arguments that other DTS supporters or John Dyer have made before, on this or previous posts, and we have already rebutted those arguments.

    DTS defenders need to read all the threads we have on our various DTS posts (of which there are currently three). If they do, they will see that we started off being quite willing to discuss the issue with DTS representatives without rancor. But DTS’s responses via John Dyer, and the lack of responses from Dickens and Barnes, have bit by bit diminished our hope and confidence in their willingness to deal with our concerns in good faith.

    In these comments, DTS supporters have complained that we are making assumptions, blasting DTS without proper information, and emailing DTS rather than making first hand contact. It doesn’t wash. We were aware of the possibility that we might be making false assumptions, so we gave DTS the opportunity to comment, explain and correct our perception of their use of that book. We emailed because Jeff and I live far, far away from Texas. DTS Counseling faculty could easily have emailed us and arranged to have a phone call with Jeff, or a Skype call with me, if they had wanted to.

    When people want to evade taking responsibility for their wrongdoing, they often accuse the whistleblower of blowing the whistle in the wrong way. . . . the wrong tone, the wrong pitch, the wrong volume, the wrong medium.

    • Brenda R

      Barb,

      So now ACFJ is the bad guy. The book is in the library of a seminary who is teaching Bible. It does not belong. Which part of this don’t they understand. This is a bad book. There may be others in the series that are equally wrong, only time will tell. Satan is certainly having a field day with this one. One would think that DTS supporters would take time to reflect and ask: “If Jesus came into our school and found this book knowing how he loved children, would be happy that it was on our shelves?” That question doesn’t seem to be asked or time to even pray about the situation. One should not be cheerleader for a school just because they go there. They should be supporting the cause of Christ and trying to grow from what that school has to offer. Offering this book of information is not uplifting the cause of Christ. It is lowering its standards, allowing abusers to be free to do it again and putting children in harms way.

      • Anonymous

        I second that! How triggering is this for survivors – being made to be the bad guy and having to go on the defensive, for calling out abuse-friendly patterns that help the problem of abuse in the church. Fortunately, Barb didn’t fall for it and didn’t go into self-doubt mode, which probably makes her (to some DV-ignorant Christian bystanders) an obstinate, bitter, angry, feministic advocate. Don’t ask me where the logic lies.

        Speaking of logic, the only questions that have to be asked are – has the book been used till recently, does the book suggest not reporting under certain circumstances, is that against the law and is it unethical. If the answers are yes, then the next question could be, is that why we are gobsmacked? And, should we not be outraged? The last question is of course rhetorical. All other attempts to divert from the main issue, which is the content of the book, feel dismissive.

      • Thanks, Anonymous 🙂
        obstinate — yes in that I’m dogged and determined not to give up standing for the truth and justice
        bitter — no
        angry — yes outraged, but able to temper it and express it appropriately
        feministic — not in the sense that most people ascribe to that word. But yes if it means I stand against the mistreatment of women (and all who are mistreated, whatever their sex)
        advocate yeah

  18. Still Scared( but getting angry)

    Just heard, the book is OFF reserve! Still probably in the library but pulled from the Reserve list to be used in class.

    • Well that is a teeny bit of progress eh?
      It took some arm-twisting to get them to do it, though.

      I wonder if it’s still to be found in the catalogue? Or on the main shelves somewhere? Dyer said it was being pulled from the shelves, maybe some DTS students with ethics can check that for us.

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